Ideas for solo hiking – South Maui

In April 2020 we are required to keep a distance from people outside of our own household to slow the spread of the coronavirus COVID-19 and to allow our health and other services to take care of those who need help. Sierra Club has therefor canceled all organized outings until further notice. But we are still allowed to venture out on our own or with members of our own household for exercise such as walking, running, hiking, swimming and surfing. No need to stay cooped up at home all day. Just keep at least six feet between yourself and anyone you meet. This is the first of several posts on good places to go hiking/walking without a guide.

South Maui is blessed with miles of easily accessible coastline that even novice hikers can enjoy. You can walk from beach to beach with only short detours on low grassy bluffs all the way from Kalama Park to Ulua Beach, over 3 miles. This stretch includes beautiful views out over low rocky cliffs as well as eight sandy beaches. Stay as close as you can to the water to keep on this trail. When you get to the South end of Ulua Beach you can walk up to the paved Wailea Beach Walk and continue for another mile to Polo Beach. No need to do the whole trail – you can generally get to it from South Kihei Road or Wailea Alanui Drive from one or both ends of any of the ten beaches it passes. Here is an approximate map of the 4+ mile (one-way) path described:

bit.ly/south-maui-walk

 

Important Resources for Maui County as of 3/27/20:

SHELTER 

HOMELESS SERVICE ORGANIZATIONS: HAWAII (Source www.hud.gov) 

Aloha House P. O. Box 791779 Paia, HI 96779 (808) 579-9584 Services Offered: Transitional Shelter, Residential, and Outpatient Substance Abuse Treatment Program 

Aloha United Way Dial 2-1-1 anywhere in Hawaii Aloha United Way 211 is a free, confidential information and referral service available 24 hours a day. Services offered: Direct referrals, General Information, Volunteer Opportunities 

Community Clinic of Maui 1881 Nani St. Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 871-7772 Services offered: Medical Care, Health Education, Social Services, Dental Care, Behavioral and Mental Health, Transgender Care and WIC services. 

Family Life Center 95 S. Kane St. Kahului, HI 96732 Phone (808) 877-0880 Services Offered: Emergency shelter, Food, Clothing, Outreach Services, Mail Service, Referral Servicewomen and children only. 

Hale Kau Kau 25 W. Lipoa Street Kihei, HI 96753 (808) 875-8754 Services Offered: Meal Service for Homeless, Meal delivery to homebound elderly and disabled, Emergency Food Boxes  

Ka Lima O Maui 95 Mahalani Street Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 244-5502 Services Offered: Job Training for the Disabled/Disadvantaged, Employment Services 

Kahale A Ke Ola Homeless Resource Center 670 Waiale Drive Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 242-7600 Services offered: Emergency Shelter, Transitional Housing, Food, Life Skills, Job Training, Substance Abuse Treatment, Case Management, Health Care, Child Care, Headstart Program, GED Preparation, Adult Education 

Malama Family Recovery Center 388 Ano Street Kahului, HI 96732 (808) 877-7117 Services Offered: Therapeutic Living Program for Substance Abusers, Intensive Outpatient Program, Baby Safe Program for Pregnant Women and New Mothers 

Maui Economic Opportunity 99 Mahalani Road Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 249-2970 Services Offered: Rental Assistance dependent on availability of funding (call for eligibility criteria), Referrals for food and clothing, Medical prescription assistance, job assistance 

Maui Youth and Family Services Confidential Shelter Location Please call for information (808) 579-8406 Services Offered: Short-term Shelter for 12-17-year-old youths in crisis and runaways 

Office for Social Ministry 95 Mahalani Street Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 244-8106 Services Offered: Mobile Care Health Project – Maui Dental Clinic, Referrals 

Salvation Army Homeless Program 45 W. Kamehameha Avenue Kahului, HI 96732 (808) 877-3042 Services Offered: Lunch service 11:00-11:30, Limited Shower & Laundry Facilities, Mail Service, Referral Service 

Women Helping Women 1935 Main Street, Suite 202 Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 242-6600 Shelter Hotline: (808) 579-9581 Services Offered: Temporary Shelter for victims of domestic violence, Self-Sufficiency Program with Financial Assistance 

American Red Cross – Maui County Office 

95 Mahalani Street Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 244-0051 Provides immediate emergency assistance to victims of disasters, including food, shelter, clothing, crisis counseling and other services.  

FOOD 

Maui Food Pantries, Soup Kitchens & Food Banks 

Below are all of the Emergency Food Programs provided through Food Pantries and Soup Kitchens in Maui, Hawaii and surrounding cities that I have located. 

* Note: If you are searching for Maui Food Banks – Food banks are distribution hubs. They supply the food to the Soup Kitchens, Food Pantries, Shelters etc. They in turn provide that food to the individuals that need it. Food Banks do not directly serve individuals in need

** Make sure you check by calling the food pantry to confirm that they still are in operation and the hours have not changed. 

Active Listings in Maui Hawaii 

Kula, HI St. John’s Episcopal Church 

Kula, HI 96790 

808-878-1485 

St. John’s Episcopal Church is a food pantry. Serves Kula on the island of Maui. Must register and ID is required.. 

Kihei, HI Feed My Sheep 

Kihei, HI 96753 

808-870-9421 

Feed My Sheep is a food pantry. Serves Kahului and Lahaina on the island of Maui. ID must be presented upon registration and for all family members being claimed. Food pantry service hours: Saturday: 10:30 am – 12 pm. 

Kihei, HI Keolahou Church 

Kihei, HI 96753 

808-879-4693 

Keolahou Church is a food pantry. Serves Kihei on the island of Maui. Must register first and ID and proof of residency are required.Food pantry service hours: Friday: 9 am – 10 am. * Make sure you check by calling the food pantry to confirm that they still are in operation 

Pukalani, HI Grace Church 

Pukalani, HI 96788 

808-572-8384 

Grace Church is a food pantry. Serves Upcountry and Kula areas on the island of Maui. Food pantry service hours: Wednesdays 12-1 pm. . 

Makawao, HI St Joseph Church Outreach Program – Makawao 

Makawao, HI 96768 

808-572-7652 

St Joseph Church Outreach Program – Makawao provides a food pantry. Serves Upcountry Maui (Haiku, Haliimaile, Kula, Makawao, Pukalani, Olinda). Need to bring verification of income and need to bring a utility bill, etc. 

Kahului, HI Christ the King Outreach Pantry 

Kahului, HI 96732 

Christ the King Outreach Pantry is a food pantry. Serves Kahului on the island of Maui. ID required. Food pantry service hours: 2nd and 4th Friday of the month: 3 – 5 pm. 

Wailuku, HI Ka Hale Ake Ola 

Wailuku, HI 96793 

808-242-7600 

Ka Hale Ake Ola is a food pantry. Serves Wailuku on the island of Maui. Must register and ID is required. Food pantry service hours: Monday and Wednesdays 1 pm – 3 pm.  

Kahului, HI Salvation Army – Kahului Corps Family Services 

Kahului, HI 96732 

808-877-6757 

Salvation Army – Kahului Corps Family Services is a food pantry. Serves Maui (not including Lahaina). Documentation Needed: Proof of identification, low-income status, and residence required. Food pantry service hours: Thursday: 9 am – 12pm (By appointment). 

Wailuku, HI Wailuku Church of God 

Wailuku, HI 96793 

808-264-0435 

Wailuku Church of God is a food pantry. Serves Lahaina, Kihei, and Central areas on Maui.. * Make sure you check by calling the food pantry to confirm that they still are in operation and the hours as the hours have not changed. 

Wailuku, HI Wailuku Union Church 

Wailuku, HI 96793 

808-244-9177 

Wailuku Union Church is a food pantry. Serves Wailuku on the island of Maui. Must be a resident of Paia, Wailuku, or Kahului. Picture I.D. and proof of residency are required to receive assistance. Food pantry service hours: Saturday: 8:30 am – 11:30 am. . 

Wailuku, HI Feed My Sheep 

Wailuku, HI 96793 

808-870-9421 

Feed My Sheep is a food pantry. Serves Kahului and Lahaina on the island of Maui. ID must be presented upon registration and for all family members being claimed. Food pantry service hours: Saturday: 9:30 am – 12 pm. 

Hana, HI Feed My Sheep 

Hana, HI 96713 

808-870-9421  

Feed My Sheep is a food pantry. Serves Kahului and Lahaina on the island of Maui. ID must be presented upon registration and for all family members being claimed. Food pantry service hours: Wednesdays 4:30 pm – 6 pm. 

Wailuku, HI Maui Food Bank, Inc. 

Wailuku, HI 96793 

Maui Food Bank’S Mission Is To Help The Hungry In Maui County By Collecting And Distributing Food Through Community Partnerships. 

Haiku, HI Feed My Sheep 

Haiku, HI 96708 

808-870-9421 

Feed My Sheep is a food pantry. Serves Kahului and Lahaina on the island of Maui. ID must be presented upon registration and for all family members being claimed. Food pantry service hours: Saturday: 9:30 am – 11 am. 

Lahaina, HI Salvation Army – Lahaina Corps 

Lahaina, HI 96761 

808-661-5335 

Salvation Army – Lahaina Corps is a food pantry. Serves West Maui and Lanai. Need to bring verification of income, identification, and proof of emergency. Food pantry service hours: Thursday: 9 am – 1:30 pm. 

Lahaina, HI Feed My Sheep 

Lahaina, HI 96761 

808-870-9421 

Feed My Sheep is a food pantry. Serves Kahului and Lahaina on the island of Maui. ID must be presented upon registration and for all family members being claimed. Food 

Kihei, HI Hale Kau Kau 

(808) 875-8754 

Dinner is served to all for free, no questions asked, from 5 to 6 p.m. every weeknight; and on weekends, 4:30 to 5:30 p.m. 

Meal deliveries are provided (by referral only from health care providers, insurance companies, the County’s Office on Aging and nonprofits) to the frail, sick, elderly and disabled in South Maui. Volunteers are always welcome both in the kitchen and especially for meal deliveries. pantry service hours: Thursday: 10:30 – 11: 45 am. 

American Red Cross – Maui County Office 

95 Mahalani Street Wailuku, HI 96793 (808) 244-0051 Provides immediate emergency assistance to victims of disasters, including food, shelter, clothing, crisis counseling, and other services. Offers classes in CPR and first aid. For military personnel, provides emergency communication services, counseling … 

DOE Schools who will have grab and go meals 

Thank you Katie Folio of Coalition for a Tobacco-Free Hawaii for sharing the information. 

Click below for List of DOE Schools who will have grab and go meals (updated 3/27/20) 

http://www.hawaiipublicschools.org/DOE%20Forms/Emergencies/2020GrabandGo.pdf 

Guide to EBT in Hawaii: food stamp (SNAP) eligibility 

See the below resources. 

https://www.freshebt.com/state/hawaii/food-stamps-eligibility-income-limits/ 

https://humanservices.hawaii.gov/bessd/snap/  

 

SuperMarkets special hours: 

Maui grocery stores have announced shopping hours for kupuna (elders/senior citizens) and high-risk shoppers. 

Mana Foods: every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday from 8-9 am. 

Whole Foods: daily from 7-8 am. 

Safeway: 7 am-9 am on Tuesdays and Thursdays. 

Tamura’s: Monday, Wednesday, and Friday from 7-8 am. 

Foodland: the first hour on Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday. 

Times Supermarket: first hour daily. 

Island Grocery Depot: 6:30-7:30 am Monday and Wednesday. 

Walmart and Costco are also providing senior shopping time slots. Please contact your favorite Maui grocery stores for more information. 

(info from Mauitime.com 3/23/20) DONATE to Maui Food Bank 

Please spread the word that MFB is in need of food and monetary donations to support families on Maui, Molokai and Lānaʻi. 

https://mauifoodbank.org/ 

Make a donation: https://mauifoodbank.org/donate/ 

Virtual Food drive: https://mauifoodbank.org/virtual-food-drive/ 

Please sign up for their newsletter and follow on social media 

https://www.facebook.com/MauiFoodBank/ 

https://www.instagram.com/mauifoodbank/ 

 

RENT and FOOD $ 

Maui Economic Opportunity COVID-19 Food and Rental Assistance 

To ensure hardworking individuals and families are able to obtain necessary food and/or maintain their current living situation, MEO will assist individuals and families experiencing financial hardship due to layoffs or a reduction in hours associated with COVID-19. 

Click the link below for the form and further instructions. The form and all associated documents can be emailed to info@meoinc.org or sent to Maui Economic Opportunity, Inc. P.O. Box 2122 Kahului, HI 96733. 

http://www.meoinc.org/UserFiles/File/Food%20Assistance.Rental%20Program.pdf 

MEO is a nonprofit Community Action Agency committed to helping low-income individuals and families become stable and achieve economic security. MEO’s services are constantly changing to meet the needs of children and families, the disabled and medically needy, and the elderly and other low-income individuals. MEO works with more than twenty-five community partners to help people and change lives. All MEO programs are tangible translations of the Promise of Community Action. 

MEO has been “helping people…changing lives” for over 50 years and is an articulate advocate for those whose voices are often not heard. From transportation and early childhood education to assist with small business development MEO works in concert with the public and private sector. 

MEO provides tools to help people and change lives with programs offered through five departments: 

  • The BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT CENTER assists small business entrepreneurs with business plan training, credit assessment, and microloans for startup and expansion. 
  • COMMUNITY SERVICES provides a wide array of services including rental subsidy, employment training, and job placement, Enlace Hispano (Hispanic Link), weatherization and energy assistance, senior club coordination, prisoner reintegration, Hawaiian agricultural workshops, BEST Reintegration, Ke Kahua farm and more. 
  • EARLY CHILDHOOD SERVICES provides quality infant care and early childhood education, offering toddlers a Head Start toward better education and a better life. 
  • The TRANSPORTATION Department provides rides to the doctor, to work, to school, to adult daycare, for necessary shopping, and for other needs with both standard and wheelchair lift-equipped vehicles. 
  • The YOUTH SERVICES Department provides youth with assistance to succeed in school and life through fun-filled opportunities to learn life skills, prepare for the workforce, and serve the community. The prevention of underage drinking, substance abuse, tobacco use, teenage pregnancy, and teenage suicide is consistently blended with youth program activities. 

MEO is dedicated to providing tools for living, for earning, for self-reliance, and for community involvement. All programs are designed with the underlying belief that instead of giving people a fish, it is better to teach them how to fish for themselves. 

For details of their services, go to http://www.meoinc.org/ 

EBT in Hawaii: food stamp (SNAP) 

Go to https://humanservices.hawaii.gov/bessd/1961-2/ for details and Online application form. 

For questions, please call 808-984-8300 or 808-243-5110 

 

UNEMPLOYMENT 

Need to file an unemployment claim? Here’s how to do it 

By HNN Staff | March 18, 2020, at 5:31 PM HST – Updated March 19 at 10:46 AM 

HONOLULU, Hawaii (HawaiiNewsNow) – Unemployment claims are already starting to pour into the state as businesses shut down amid the coronavirus pandemic. 

In fact, there were so many claims filed Wednesday, the online system nearly crashed. 

To try and prevent people from waiting in long lines at the unemployment office, the state launched an online filing system Tuesday. https://uiclaims.hawaii.gov/ 

Think you might like to file? Here what you need to know: 

  • What is unemployment? 

Unemployment insurance is administered by the state and is meant to provide workers with temporary financial assistance who lose their job through no fault of their own. 

In Hawaii, employers pay the costs of unemployment insurance through a payroll tax. 

  • How do you apply for unemployment? 

To file online, go to: https://huiclaims.hawaii.gov Earlier this week, the governor waived the one-week waiting period for benefits. If you have questions, you’re being asked to call the claims office nearest to you: 

Oahu: 586-8970 

Hilo: 974-4086 

Kona: 322-4822 

Maui: 984-8400 

Kauai: 274-3043 

  • How much can I qualify for? 

Here’s how the state explains the calculation: “Your weekly benefit amount is calculated by dividing the wages in the highest quarter of your base period by 21.” 

There is a maximum weekly benefit: $648 a week. The minimum is $5 a week. 

For more eligibility requirements, go to http://labor.hawaii.gov/ui/faq/ 

 

 BUSINESS LOAN 

For all industries 

Go to Small Business Administration (SBA) 

https://www.sba.gov/page/coronavirus-covid-19-small-business-guidance-loan- resources 

For information on: 

Economic Injury Disaster Loan Program 

SBA Express Bridge Loans 

Guidance for Businesses and Employers 

Lots of very useful information for business owners! 

 

For Farmers 

https://hfbf.org/covid-19-updates-resources/ 

For information on: 

Farm safety 

Potential markets for produce 

Financial resources for producers 

We also suggest that you contact your local banks for more resources 

 

GET UPDATES 

Latest News and updates 

Maui County News 

https://www.mauicounty.gov/2370/COVID-19-Coronavirus-Information 

COVID 19 latest news and updates by the Hawaii Department of Health 

https://health.hawaii.gov/docd/advisories/novel-coronavirus-2019/ 

Sign up for Maka`ala – Maui County Emergency Alert 

https://member.everbridge.net/892807736722768/login 

CDC COVID 19 updates 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/index.html 

HAWAI‘I COVID-19 JOINT INFORMATION CENTER DAILY NEWS DIGEST 

https://www.mauiamericanjobcenter.com/hawaii-covid-19-daily-digest 

Stay up to date with the fast-moving flow of information. Get your questions answered by clicking on the links below. We will update this page regularly to keep you informed of daily news. 

Covid – 19 State Department of Health 

eHawaii.gov – Official Website of the Aloha State 

Governor’s Newsroom Updates 

Hawaii Department of Health – Updates 

Department of Transportation 

Department of Hawaiian Homelands 

Department of Education 

 

Medical Services Medical Services 

If you think you have been exposed to COVID-19 and develop a fever and symptoms, such as cough or difficulty breathing, call your healthcare provider for medical advice. 

Maui Health Hospitals info on COVID 19 https://www.mauihealth.org/health-resources/covid-19/ 

KAISER info on COVID 19 https://healthy.kaiserpermanente.org/hawaii/health-wellness/coronavirus- information 

Addiction/chemical dependency treatment Addiction/chemical dependency treatment on Maui. Utilizing technologies to assist people to use remote technologies when possible. 

People with addiction are especially vulnerable during times of stress and isolation. Obviously, those who smoke anything are encouraged to seek treatment to reduce their own personal risk of worsening of any underlying respiratory illness. https://ponohealthcare.com https://akamai.healthcare 

The WIC Program of the State of Hawaii Dept The WIC Program of the State of Hawaii Dept. of Health is open and accepting families and individuals who are pregnant, breastfeeding, and children up to the age of five. They may call 808-984-8225 for more information and sign up. https://health.hawaii.gov/wic/ 

List compiled by Office of Economic Development 2200 Main Street, Suite 305 Wailuku, HI 96793 808-270-7415 

 

Annual Meeting

2020 Annual Meeting graphic
Members and Non-Members Welcome!

Maui Group Annual meeting on Leap day, February 29 was a great chance to honor environmental heroes and enjoy good food, fun and fellowship. Mahalo to Flatbread Pizza, Nalu’s South Shore Grill, Monsoon India, Hawaiian Moons, Aloha Aina BBQ, Maui Coffee Roasters and Maui Sustainable Solutions for food and beverage donations. About 100 attendees got legislative updates from Chapter Policy advocate Jodi Malinoski, Rep Tina Wildberger and Council member Shane Sinenci.

congratulations to our award winners:

Onipa‘a: Walle Landenberger and Kai Nishiki
Mālama ka ‘āina: Justin Kekiwi, Tina Roth, Autumn Rae Ness
Mālama kahaki: Jim Koons, Bob Aldrich
Volunteer of the Year: Kim Toomey

 

Re-Tree Hawaii

The news on the climate front continues to get worse. We had at least one day in February when Antarctica was warmer (65 degrees) than many places on Maui. Melting glaciers and polar ice caps will trigger an accelerating increase in carbon dioxide and global temperatures.

Hawai‘i has to do its part to reach carbon neutrality – stop releasing more net greenhouse gases that capture heat in the atmosphere – by shutting down all fossil fuel plants (Kahului and Ma‘alaea on Maui), replacing ground transportation with electric or other zero-emission vehicles, improving public transportation and replacing inter-island traffic with more efficient and ultimately zero-carbon-emitting means of travel. More local production of food and other goods for consumption in Hawaii will reduce the need for shipping, which is a significant source of greenhouse gases. Limiting tourism to sustainable levels would dampen the continued growth in flights.

However, air and sea transport to and from Hawaii will continue to generate very large amounts of greenhouse gases for years beyond when the steps above have been taken, and we have an accumulated carbon debt which will take even longer to pay off. We have to also invest in removing carbon dioxide (CO2) from the atmosphere.

There are new technologies in the works that may help, but there is one established technology that has been around since before the industrial revolution, before man, before any animal life: photosynthesis. Plants consume CO2 and water with the help of sunlight and produce oxygen. Trees are champions in that they can continue to do this work for dozens or hundreds of years once they get started.

Unfortunately, the increase in CO2 emissions has been paralleled by continuous destruction of forest areas on the planet – 15 billion trees per year according to one article, with only 5 billion replanted. Most of this is due to expansion of industrial agriculture and logging.

We can do better, much better! Lā Ho‘oulu Pae Moku – ReTree Hawaii – is a campaign to plant trees (and other plants) in every region of every populated Hawaiian island on October 30, 2020. Find how how you can be part of the solution:

https://retree-hawaii.org

Whale Day 2020!

The Sierra Club hosted a booth at Whale Day on Feb 8th at Kalama Park in the “Eco-Alley” section of this annual event.  It was a huge success with many participants asking for more information on climate change, water rights issues, agriculture, cultural preservation and much more!  We had an “Eco-stamp bracelet” activity and a Volcanoes National Park coloring activity as well as information on our native endangered Hoary Bat for the keiki to enjoy.  We even enlisted new volunteers and members!

Sierra Club Benefit Night at Maui Ocean Center

Kecia & Flip 

Thank you to Tapani Vuori, Flip Nicklin, and those who join us for a fantastic “Sierra Club Benefit Night” at the Maui Ocean Center Sphere! We learned, we laughed, and we were inspired by all that was shared of the many years of whale research, underwater photography, and video footage captured by award winning National Geographic photographer Flip Nicklin. You can learn more of the latest research at the upcoming 14th Annual Whale Tales Event hosted by Whale Trust.

Supreme Court Oral Hearings in Lahaina Injection Wells Case November 6, 2019

This is the Supreme Court justices (in black) questioning Mayor Victorino’s lawyers (in red), slightly condensed.

Coral reef image courtesy of Caitlin Maratea, owner of Banyan Tree Divers in Lahaina.

Elbert Lin
Your Honor, I think if it still goes through the groundwater, the — the question under the statute is what is the — what is the conveyance, what is the thing that carries and delivers the pollutants.

I think even if it’s forcefully put into the groundwater, the groundwater is what’s carrying it. Now I can imagine, Your Honor, scenarios as we discuss in our brief where you’ve got, say, a point source, a pipe that’s very close to the water’s edge and — and expels the pollutants into the water.

The thing that’s carrying it, the last conveyance in that factual scenario, would be the pipe.

Justice Stephen G. Breyer
So what happens if you just take the pipe and you decide what we’ll do is we’re going to end the pipe 35 feet from the river or from the ocean or something? Now you know perfectly well that it’ll drip down into the ground and it’ll be carried out into the navigable water. In your theory, that isn’t covered?

Elbert Lin
In that scenario, Your Honor, the land is the conveyance and that pollution would be regulated under the nonpoint source —

Justice Stephen G. Breyer
Well, no, the conveyance is the groundwater that is underneath the land into which the pipe drips the pollutant.

Elbert Lin
— then the groundwater is what’s carrying and delivering the pollutants —

Justice Stephen G. Breyer
All right, but then what we have is, I take it, an absolute road map for people who want to avoid the point source regulation.

All we do is we just cut off the — cut off the — the pipes or whatever, five feet from the ocean or five feet from the navigable stream or five feet from — you see? You understand the problem. What I’m looking for in this case is what’s a standard that will prevent evasion, which I’m not — I don’t see how yours prevents evasion.

Justice Elena Kagan
Excuse me, Mr. Lin. Congress wanted the point source program to do something.

The Congress wanted point sources that were discharging pollutants to receive a permit before they did so.

And I think what Justice Breyer is saying is that nobody would ever have to go through that process of getting a permit if they knew that they could do something like what Justice Breyer was suggesting, just stop the pipe five feet before the ocean.

Justice Sonia Sotomayor
— but that’s the problem, isn’t it? Because it presumes the state will regulate, and some states don’t.

So what you’re doing is cutting off permitting because you’re limiting the word “to” — or — or morphing the word “to navigable waters” and changing it into “into navigable waters.” And that’s what Justice Scalia looked at was the plain text and said “to” is different than “into.” And so, for us, the question, I believe, is, do you read the plain language and does it say from a point source, it’s the well, to the ocean? It can be traced, yes.

I think the words are pretty clear.

Elbert Lin
A few answers to that, Your Honor.

Justice Sonia Sotomayor
To — to — to accept your meaning, we have to transform “in” into “into.”

Elbert Lin
Your Honor, if I could start with the statutory language, I think the wells as an example is important to address, but if you — I think if you look at the words “addition from any point source,” and you substitute in, for point source, pipe, which is in the statute and nobody disagrees is a — is a point source, addition to a lake, to an ocean, to a river, a navigable water, an addition to a lake of pollutants from a pipe, addition to a lake of sewage water from a pipe. I think, I submit, Your Honor, that the ordinary understanding of that, what one pictures in one’s mind is a pipe that is next to the water, not a pipe that is a mile away.

— that has delivery in it and it’s — it’s being associated with conveyance, which is a thing that transports, carries, and delivers.

Justice Brett M. Kavanaugh
That sounds like the directly argument that Justice Scalia’s opinion rejected.

Elbert Lin
Your Honor, we don’t think it can be found in the text because we don’t read “from” — we don’t think Congress intended “from” to mean causation.

So, one, we don’t think it can be found in the text.

Two —

Justice Elena Kagan
But that would be a normal way of reading the word “from,” wouldn’t it; in other words, to say, to decide whether something is from something else, you have to look as to whether it’s from something else? (Laughter.)

Malcolm L. Stewart
If it goes five feet to the shore and the pollutant travels onto the land, travels across the land and into the water, you know, through its own force, it spews out of the pipe or simply through the force of gravity because you’re on an incline, we would say that’s covered.

Justice Elena Kagan
So, if the pipe is on the — is on the land and spews onto the land, it’s regulated and you need a permit; but, if the pipe is underground, it’s not and you don’t need a permit?

Malcolm L. Stewart
You would not need a — you would not need a NPDES permit because you would not be discharging onto — you would not be discharging to the navigable water —

Justice Stephen G. Breyer
It’s the same problem

Justice Stephen G. Breyer
Just if you have a reaction to this.

If I don’t accept — I’m not saying — but if I don’t accept because I think these two programs are quite different, ground source and point source, different purposes, et cetera, and I’m worried about the evasion or area, you see, that we talked about first. So it seems to me this case, in my mind at the moment, is what’s the standard for separating the sheep from the goats? And you’re basically saying the Ninth Circuit’s way too broad and so are they, so we come up with zero, okay? Close to zero. Now the best — I want to try out one thing, if you think — have any reaction to it. If it’s — it’s regulated or under this, if it’s the functional equivalent of a direct discharge. Now the reason that I put that is because that leaves a lot of room for the EPA to write regulations, to decide what is the functional equivalent of a direct discharge.

And it’s narrower than the Ninth Circuit.

You want to — if you have to have a reaction to that, have it.

Malcolm L. Stewart
I still have concerns about any approach that could be interpreted as saying if the pollutants make it to the navigable water, then it’s covered.

Justice Sonia Sotomayor
Why are you doing what you’re doing? This is fairly traceable to you in large quantities.

The state didn’t control you.

What regulations are there in place that do?

— I mean the — the polluters.

What are they — what is being done to stop them?

If they followed —

— all the laws, and they still are polluting, they’re getting away with it.

So something failed.

The preventive measures of this law were not followed and something failed.